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	Comments on: The Regional Reckoning	</title>
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		<title>
		By: Carlos Si		</title>
		<link>https://askthepilot.com/the-regional-reckoning/#comment-398562</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Carlos Si]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 22 May 2023 03:02:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://askthepilot.com/?p=17181#comment-398562</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[I was &quot;born 5 years too early&quot;.

I finished/was finishing college right before the regionals started to up their game and pay. I would have invested in flight training knowing in just a few years, I&#039;d be paying back my loans in no time.

Instead, my degree got me nowhere, my peers are all advancing to the majors, and I&#039;m paying out of pocket for my training 6 years later, still trying to earn the CFI certificate.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I was &#8220;born 5 years too early&#8221;.</p>
<p>I finished/was finishing college right before the regionals started to up their game and pay. I would have invested in flight training knowing in just a few years, I&#8217;d be paying back my loans in no time.</p>
<p>Instead, my degree got me nowhere, my peers are all advancing to the majors, and I&#8217;m paying out of pocket for my training 6 years later, still trying to earn the CFI certificate.</p>
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		<title>
		By: Tom		</title>
		<link>https://askthepilot.com/the-regional-reckoning/#comment-398557</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Tom]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 20 May 2023 02:13:42 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://askthepilot.com/?p=17181#comment-398557</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[continued...

because the company also operates at American Eagle and Delta Connection.

The expert then said:   &quot;Why did United&#039;s Munoz apologize?&quot;

I replied because he&#039;d rather apologize then explain to the flying public that they&#039;ve been put on &quot;puddle-jumper&quot; subcontractors they&#039;ve never heard about like Mesa, Air Wisconsin, and Commutair unless they&#039;ve actually read the back of the Safety Cards!

&quot;Well, I&#039;ll have to look into that, that doesn&#039;t sound right to me&quot;]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>continued&#8230;</p>
<p>because the company also operates at American Eagle and Delta Connection.</p>
<p>The expert then said:   &#8220;Why did United&#8217;s Munoz apologize?&#8221;</p>
<p>I replied because he&#8217;d rather apologize then explain to the flying public that they&#8217;ve been put on &#8220;puddle-jumper&#8221; subcontractors they&#8217;ve never heard about like Mesa, Air Wisconsin, and Commutair unless they&#8217;ve actually read the back of the Safety Cards!</p>
<p>&#8220;Well, I&#8217;ll have to look into that, that doesn&#8217;t sound right to me&#8221;</p>
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		<title>
		By: Tom		</title>
		<link>https://askthepilot.com/the-regional-reckoning/#comment-398556</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Tom]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 20 May 2023 02:09:36 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://askthepilot.com/?p=17181#comment-398556</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[This may spell the end for Regionals.   I just hope they get folded in to the mainlines.
Regionals, in their present form, are not true airlines unlike the companies Patrick and I started with.    They don&#039;t sell tickets, they can&#039;t increase the frequency on routes either.   They don&#039;t staff their own counters at terminals and others take care of screening and baggage.
The mainline airline sells off their leaner routes to the lowest bidder (no always, of course).   The way the regional maximizes profits is by cutting costs for they are unable to raise prices.
There is also something inherently inefficient in smaller jets.   Ever wonder why you don&#039;t see turbine powered cars?   Jet engines derive their efficiency on long routes at high altitudes and being as big as possible.   Use a small jet engine on short routes and the cost per passenger goes up.  The system relies on cheap labor.  

The odd thing about this is that the typical passenger can&#039;t tell you what airline he&#039;s flying on half the time.  (In my day and certainly Patrick&#039;s they could.)
Remember when that fella was dragged off the United flight in ORD?   I was listening to the radio when they had this aviation expect on saying this was inexcusable for United to do this considering the profits they&#039;re making blah blah.      I called in and said the expert didn&#039;t know what he was talking about because this took place on Republic Airlines which has no contract with the passenger and it was silly to boycott United]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>This may spell the end for Regionals.   I just hope they get folded in to the mainlines.<br />
Regionals, in their present form, are not true airlines unlike the companies Patrick and I started with.    They don&#8217;t sell tickets, they can&#8217;t increase the frequency on routes either.   They don&#8217;t staff their own counters at terminals and others take care of screening and baggage.<br />
The mainline airline sells off their leaner routes to the lowest bidder (no always, of course).   The way the regional maximizes profits is by cutting costs for they are unable to raise prices.<br />
There is also something inherently inefficient in smaller jets.   Ever wonder why you don&#8217;t see turbine powered cars?   Jet engines derive their efficiency on long routes at high altitudes and being as big as possible.   Use a small jet engine on short routes and the cost per passenger goes up.  The system relies on cheap labor.  </p>
<p>The odd thing about this is that the typical passenger can&#8217;t tell you what airline he&#8217;s flying on half the time.  (In my day and certainly Patrick&#8217;s they could.)<br />
Remember when that fella was dragged off the United flight in ORD?   I was listening to the radio when they had this aviation expect on saying this was inexcusable for United to do this considering the profits they&#8217;re making blah blah.      I called in and said the expert didn&#8217;t know what he was talking about because this took place on Republic Airlines which has no contract with the passenger and it was silly to boycott United</p>
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		<title>
		By: Tom		</title>
		<link>https://askthepilot.com/the-regional-reckoning/#comment-398555</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Tom]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 20 May 2023 01:48:28 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://askthepilot.com/?p=17181#comment-398555</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[I started a few years after you.   My first year, I flew 1,158 hours and made ZERO dollars.   I was still collecting unemployment amounting to almost $500/mo.   After a year and a half, they couldn&#039;t rely completely on pilots with tourist and student visas so, they started to pay us (those who could legally work in the USA).  With the loss of unemployment, I was taking home LESS but at least I qualified for $83/mo in food stamps.   It could&#039;ve been more but there was no explaining to the bureaucrats that 80-100hrs of flying a month wasn&#039;t part time employment.   I never had so little job security in my career, and when I left, those who remained were being replaced by Red Chinese pilots whose government was giving the company $90k for each of them to build hours.
Still, it shaved years off the time to my destination.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I started a few years after you.   My first year, I flew 1,158 hours and made ZERO dollars.   I was still collecting unemployment amounting to almost $500/mo.   After a year and a half, they couldn&#8217;t rely completely on pilots with tourist and student visas so, they started to pay us (those who could legally work in the USA).  With the loss of unemployment, I was taking home LESS but at least I qualified for $83/mo in food stamps.   It could&#8217;ve been more but there was no explaining to the bureaucrats that 80-100hrs of flying a month wasn&#8217;t part time employment.   I never had so little job security in my career, and when I left, those who remained were being replaced by Red Chinese pilots whose government was giving the company $90k for each of them to build hours.<br />
Still, it shaved years off the time to my destination.</p>
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		<title>
		By: Mark		</title>
		<link>https://askthepilot.com/the-regional-reckoning/#comment-398494</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Mark]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 04 May 2023 00:43:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://askthepilot.com/?p=17181#comment-398494</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[For comparison, you were making less than I was making working in the mailroom in 1990. But no one&#039;s life was in my hands when I pushed the cart around.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>For comparison, you were making less than I was making working in the mailroom in 1990. But no one&#8217;s life was in my hands when I pushed the cart around.</p>
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		<title>
		By: Alex B		</title>
		<link>https://askthepilot.com/the-regional-reckoning/#comment-398491</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Alex B]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 03 May 2023 14:43:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://askthepilot.com/?p=17181#comment-398491</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[I can attest to this as one of the would be pilots that was driven away.

I&#039;ve always loved airplanes, flying and traveling in general. I grew up always viewing piloting as an attractive and aspirational career choice. However coming out of college in the late 2000s, I was looking at a starting salary as a regional pilot at or possibly below $20k, while other fields were offering close to $50k right out of the gate. Combine that with the fact that having gone the college route versus military where I might&#039;ve gained some flying knowledge and experience, I was staring down the possibility of an entire career at a regional carrier. I didn&#039;t relish the idea of spending my whole life flying to places like Fargo, Topeka and Harrisburg. I wanted to fly to Hong Kong, Auckland, Istanbul, etc.

Unfortunately now in my mid-30s, in an established career with an ample salary and growth potential, it&#039;s probably too late to make the change at this point. Looks like I was born 15 years too early.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I can attest to this as one of the would be pilots that was driven away.</p>
<p>I&#8217;ve always loved airplanes, flying and traveling in general. I grew up always viewing piloting as an attractive and aspirational career choice. However coming out of college in the late 2000s, I was looking at a starting salary as a regional pilot at or possibly below $20k, while other fields were offering close to $50k right out of the gate. Combine that with the fact that having gone the college route versus military where I might&#8217;ve gained some flying knowledge and experience, I was staring down the possibility of an entire career at a regional carrier. I didn&#8217;t relish the idea of spending my whole life flying to places like Fargo, Topeka and Harrisburg. I wanted to fly to Hong Kong, Auckland, Istanbul, etc.</p>
<p>Unfortunately now in my mid-30s, in an established career with an ample salary and growth potential, it&#8217;s probably too late to make the change at this point. Looks like I was born 15 years too early.</p>
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		<title>
		By: Fernando_G		</title>
		<link>https://askthepilot.com/the-regional-reckoning/#comment-398360</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Fernando_G]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 05 Apr 2023 17:01:54 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://askthepilot.com/?p=17181#comment-398360</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[As someone who lives in a small Texas town served exclusively by regional airlines, and which will remain so in the foreseeable future, I have seen first hand some of the high handed tactics that companies subject their employees.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>As someone who lives in a small Texas town served exclusively by regional airlines, and which will remain so in the foreseeable future, I have seen first hand some of the high handed tactics that companies subject their employees.</p>
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		<title>
		By: Sheila		</title>
		<link>https://askthepilot.com/the-regional-reckoning/#comment-397413</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Sheila]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 09 Sep 2022 14:42:54 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://askthepilot.com/?p=17181#comment-397413</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[When I became a ticket agent for a regional airline in 1969, all airline jobs paid decently.  Plus, because of overall unionization (pilots, mechanics, flight attendants) we got excellent benefits.  One example: during the decade I was a ticket agent, if we worked past 8 hours in a single shift, we got overtime pay for the extra work, even if we did not go past 40 hours in the week.  And if we were called in to work for some reason (happened to me once) we got 4 hours pay even if we worked just an hour or less.

I saw the deterioration of pay and benefits after I left, and I&#039;m glad it&#039;s finally beginning to get better.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>When I became a ticket agent for a regional airline in 1969, all airline jobs paid decently.  Plus, because of overall unionization (pilots, mechanics, flight attendants) we got excellent benefits.  One example: during the decade I was a ticket agent, if we worked past 8 hours in a single shift, we got overtime pay for the extra work, even if we did not go past 40 hours in the week.  And if we were called in to work for some reason (happened to me once) we got 4 hours pay even if we worked just an hour or less.</p>
<p>I saw the deterioration of pay and benefits after I left, and I&#8217;m glad it&#8217;s finally beginning to get better.</p>
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		<title>
		By: Simon		</title>
		<link>https://askthepilot.com/the-regional-reckoning/#comment-397407</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Simon]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 09 Sep 2022 04:53:44 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://askthepilot.com/?p=17181#comment-397407</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[Not to distract from the perfectly valid points you&#039;re making, but note that the $10k/y you made in 1990 in today&#039;s USD is about $22.7k. So the increase you are observing is closer to a factor 5 than 10. Still quite amazing though.

It&#039;s about time regionals start paying pilot (as well as their other staff) what they&#039;re really worth. There is no shortage of labor, just a shortage of employers willing to pay what skilled labor is actually worth.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Not to distract from the perfectly valid points you&#8217;re making, but note that the $10k/y you made in 1990 in today&#8217;s USD is about $22.7k. So the increase you are observing is closer to a factor 5 than 10. Still quite amazing though.</p>
<p>It&#8217;s about time regionals start paying pilot (as well as their other staff) what they&#8217;re really worth. There is no shortage of labor, just a shortage of employers willing to pay what skilled labor is actually worth.</p>
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		<title>
		By: Lee Taplinger		</title>
		<link>https://askthepilot.com/the-regional-reckoning/#comment-397406</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Lee Taplinger]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 09 Sep 2022 02:54:08 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://askthepilot.com/?p=17181#comment-397406</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[I&#039;m surprised you didn&#039;t mention Colgan Air 3407 that crashed on approach to Buffalo Niagra 02/12/09 killing all 50 aboard. The pilots were paid so little they apparently had to sleep sitting up in the pilots lounge the night before and the PIC was so fatigued he responded incorrectly to a stick shaker. His FO must have sat there dumbfounded. And Colgan&#039;s HR department was so inept that they didn&#039;t catch the fact that the pilot wasn&#039;t certified to fly.

But this is America where profit is king and 50 lives lost are a cost of doing business.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;m surprised you didn&#8217;t mention Colgan Air 3407 that crashed on approach to Buffalo Niagra 02/12/09 killing all 50 aboard. The pilots were paid so little they apparently had to sleep sitting up in the pilots lounge the night before and the PIC was so fatigued he responded incorrectly to a stick shaker. His FO must have sat there dumbfounded. And Colgan&#8217;s HR department was so inept that they didn&#8217;t catch the fact that the pilot wasn&#8217;t certified to fly.</p>
<p>But this is America where profit is king and 50 lives lost are a cost of doing business.</p>
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